Sexual Purity of Muslims-Suras 24 and 33

I have resisted posting this for several weeks. But with the boldness of giving copies of the Koran to Oklahoma state officials, I must overcome my hesitancy. They and all should know what the Koran actually teaches. For how can there be honest interaction without clear vision? Hiding from the truth merely allows lies to fester. Though any and all desire purity and faithfulness to their faith, let it be to a true faith, based on true truth (as Francis Schaeffer used to preach.)

Muslims put a lot of emphasis on sexual purity. The Koran says so. Not only should women be chaste, covering themselvs, they should avert their eyes. No one should commit adultery. Should they do so, they should only marry another similarly guilty, or an Unbeliever.

If they do sin, they should be flogged with one hundred stripes, with compassion failing to move the enforcer (who should be monitored by other believers.) Lest these accusations be made recklessly, they should produce four witnesses. If they don't, then the accusers themselves should be flogged with eighty stripes. And the evidence should be rejected. The main person bringing the accusation may earn an even more serious penalty. (V. 11)
If a man brings accusation with only his own testimony, his words can be heard if he bears witness four times with an oath from Allah that he is solemnly telling the truth. Then a fifth oath invokes the curse of Allah if he is telling a lie.
But the woman can avert the punishment if she bears witness four times with an oath to Allah that her husband is telling a lie. Then she makes a fifth oath invoking the wrath of Allah if the accusation is true. (I fear what would happen if she were an Unbeliever who claims innocence, but cannot invoke Allah.)

It charges them not to listen to gossip. Or even to enter someone else's home without permission. V. 27. Personally, I see that as a "Don't ask, don't tell" position.

Men are allowed four wives, not to mention sexual slaves that their right hand possesses. Those who cannot afford wives should keep themselves chaste. They should marry a believer, or a slave who is a believer. (24:26) The next is 24:33. They should not force their maids to prostitution in order that the men might make a gain in the goods of this life, if the women desire chastity. "But if anyone compels them, yet, after such compulsion, is Allah oft-forgiving, most merciful (to them)."

That quote in verse 33 has the "to them" in parenthesis. It should be noted that those words are not in the Arabic. And only the Arabic is the "inspired" version. As Muslims who study the Bible want to consider only the words in red, discounting any passages not spoken by Jesus Himself, and eliminate any verses noted "not in the earliest manuscripts," though included and accepted by church fathers, I think it fair to note their dedication to detail here.

I deduce that their dedication to sexual purity excludes the Unbelievers and slaves, to whom anything can be done without their permission. (And somehow the men's choices to behave this way does not reflect on them morally.) I guess that the slaves might disagree. I also note the verse in the previous paragraph does not condemn them if they do rent out women for prostitution.

The sura moves on to discuss the light of Allah, and of such purity in their homes. It notes that the deeds of the Unbelievers (who are limited to one wife if they are Christian) are like a mirage in sandy deserts that thirsty men mistake for water.

In the first thirty verses of Sura 33, many subjects are treated before he gets to the subject of marriage. One point is made in verses 4-5. Your adopted sons are not your sons, so you should call them by their father's names, or call them a brother in the faith. (I don't know what kind of adopting it is, if they aren't to be considered your son. That's just the definition of adoption to me, but maybe that's just me.) This is a very important point which he returns to later.

He discusses the battles with the Unbelievers, including the People of the Book who aided them. (Another name for Christians, and Jews). "Allah did take them down from their strongholds and cast terror into their hearts so that some ye slew and some ye made prisoners. And He made you heirs of their lands, their houses, and their goods," and extended the area under Islam's control. S.33:26.
After that event, Mohammed tells his consorts if they want a worldly life, he will set them free, "in a handsome manner." Apparently this is after their homes and property are destroyed, and their land is conquered by a bunch of men who consider Unbelievers fair game to capture (for their right hand to possess.) Or they can stay with the head honcho and have some protection. (A couple of his wives were captives taken in raids.)

He moves into what is expected of his women. V.30 If any of you were guilty of evident unseemly conduct, the Punishment would be doubled to her. But if devout in service to Allah, and his Apostle, she'll get a double reward.

Verses 31-35 discuss how his wives, and all Muslim men and women can guard their chastity, being "pure and spotless." This includes their speech and dress, and staying at home. If the men want to speak to unrelated women, they can speak to them separated by screens. And women can cover themselves when they go out.


Next the subject is Mohammed. As Christians, we are taught that teachers are held to a higher standard, James 3:3. The Koran agrees this is the case, in S.33:21, "Ye have indeed in the Apostle of Allah a beautiful pattern of (conduct) for anyone whose hope is in Allah." What higher standard does Allah's Messenger, the Seal of the Prophets," set? Well, Allah out of concern for a lack of example for the men, instructs Mohammed to take his adopted son's wife.

We joined her in service to thee: in order that (in future) there may be no difficulty to the Believers in the matter of marriage with the wives of their adopted sons, when the latter have dissolved with the necessary (formality) (their marriage), and Allah's command must be fulfilled." 33:37.

For all parties, there is no question about obedience. "It is not fitting for a Believer, man or woman, when a matter has been decided by Allah and His Apostle, to have any option about their decision: if anyone disobeys A. and H. A., he is indeed on a wrong path." V.36. So Zaid, Mohammed's adopted son, divorced his wife. (We don't know how he knew it was Allah's decision, othe than taking the Messenger's word on it.)

Of course, Mo really had no option either, as "Allah's command must be fulfilled." However, Allah chastens him, "Thou didst fear the people, but it is more fitting that thou shouldst fear Allah." V. 37. So He tells the Apostle to retain his wife in wedlock, and fear Him. As another defense, just in case someone think it's just the lust of an old man taking advantage of his followers, Allah confirms that it was an approved practice of old that had passed away. V.38. (I wonder why it passed away, or why I've never heard of it.)

Mohammed encourages the others to worship and pray and live a clean life. When they marry women and divorce them without having sex (right-don't laugh), then the men don't have to wait any period (of three months to see if they're pregnant.) They can just send them away with a nice payment, uh, present. Verse 49.

Verse 53 clarifies what might be expected now and when he is gone. When they are invited to dinner they aren't to stay too long, coming either too early or staying too late. This is where he tells the men if they need to speak to his wives, they can speak through a screen.

Just for future reference, the verse continues. "Nor is it right for you that ye should annoy Allah's Apostle, or that ye should marry his widows after him at any time. Truly such a thing is in Allah's sight an enormity." Since the intro to this Sura says it was written in the fifth year after Hijrah (going to Medina), and v.27 was seven years H., he was in his sixties, and died 10 H. (632 A.D.) Aisha wasn't even 20 when he died.

Again Allah addresses Mohammed, telling him what he may do. He can have the wives whose dowries he's paid, and "those whom they right hand possesses out of the prisoners of war whom Allah has assigned to thee, and daughters of thy paternal uncles and aunts, and daughters of thy maternal uncles and aunts, ...and any believing woman...the prophet wishes to wed...." V.50. (Aisha noted, Allah was very generous to him.)

The other believers have "their wives and the captives whom their right hands possess:-in order that there should be no difficulty for thee. V.50 (*All that and seventy virgins!) They can take turns, and visit any of their wives out of turn, to prevent the women grieving.V.51.

As for Mohammed, he is to restrict himself to all the wives he has (13 females), without replacing any. Except for new sex slaves, I mean-uh, handmaidens, v. 52. With this level of sexual purity, their zeal against the flesh makes Christians appear downright frigid!

Instead of wives being a tilth they can take however they want, Christians are to submit one to another, or abstain for a time of prayer. (And if women aren't treated right, God says the men's prayers won't be heard. I Peter 3:7.) Our elders and deacons must be men with only one wife. (I Timothy 3:2,12) That does not endorse bigomy or polygamy for the others since they are taught that the relationship of a man to his wife is that of Christ to the Church-loving her and giving himself for her. For the rest, the general instruction is that if we remarry, we commit adultery unless our first partner is dead. Matthew 5:27-28. If our mates are not Christians and want out of the marriage, or if they commit adultery, then we may be free. I Corinthians 7:10-16. Then, we are free to remarry, only we are not to marry anyone who is not a Christian. 2 Corinthians 6:14.

Although the existence of slavery was tolerated in the Bible, the Christians were not given permission to molest them, to rent them out to earn money for their pimps, or to run houses of prostitution. I will not says Christians (or nominal ones) never participated in this as the history of the South (U.S.) and of slavery disproves it. But Biblically, that is not the standard. It is not endorsed by our Scriptures.

Jesus' standard is also much different that Mohammed's. Not only do we see a life of celibacy, with Him asking "which of you accuses me of sin." (None could.) He instructs us that whoever looks at a woman to lust has already committed adultery with her in his heart, Matthew 5:27-28. (The sin is not the woman's but the man's.) I can, of course, see why Jesus' instructions needed to be replaced and why Muslims consider Mohammed a senior messenger (and final) to that brought by the Lord! ;)

Paul also and Timothy, and all the apostles maintained Jesus' standards. In Romans ch. 13, Paul admonishes us. "Let us behave decently, as in the daytime, not in orgies and drunkenness, not in sexual immorality and debauchery, ....Rather, ...do not think about how to gratify the desires of the sinful nature. (V.13-14.)
Galatians tells us the flesh wars against the spirit and the natural man cannot please God. (And Romans does too.) Jesus said the entire law is summed up by a single command. Love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind, soul, and spirit, and love your neighbor as yourself. I assume that eliminates any possibility that capturing women, raping them, and keeping them enslaved will be considered acceptable spiritual behavior.

Besides fleeing youthful lusts, in II Timothy 2:22, Paul wrote his disciple to cleanse himself in order that he would be a holy vessel, set aside and useful to the Master. Verses 20-21 tell us that this way he will be prepared for any good work. In the context, the verses before and after give much more detail.

So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature. For the sinful nature desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the sinful nature. They are in conflict with each other, so that you do not do what you want... The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft, hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissentions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you...that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Along with the list of the fruit of the Spirit, he gives further instruction. Those who belong in Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires. Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. (Other sections will explain how to be born of the Spirit-i.e. become a Christian, and how to walk in the Spirit.)

While Jesus had friends and follower who were women, the Bible does not include any mention of wives. The Da Vinci Code not withstanding, the apostles-his constant companions, and the sources of the gospels as well as church history, do not mention anyone. Not only that, but when a man wanted to join the ranks of those who traveled with him, the Lord discouraged him by explaining he didn't have a stable home of dwelling.
Matthew 8:20. "The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests, but the Son of Man has no where to lay his head." If He discouraged men, more accustomed to hardships, he could hardly be expected to have a wife. (Even Robinhood had a stable place in Sherwood Forest!)

Compare this to Mohammed who had several houses, in which to house his multiple wives, and women. Included in this was his second wife Aisha, whom he married when she was six. They waited until she was all of nine to consummate their marriage-or so we are told. (Most people turn 9 in third grade, think about it.)


All this being said, I have met many Muslims who try to live a very circumspect and sexually pure life. As I also have of Christians (much more in number by virtue of where I live.) Personally, I also remained a virgin until marriage and have never physically committed adultery, though I have faced temptations and lusts. Since sexual immorality is an accusation Muslim's make against the western world, let me address this too.

First, western is not the same as Christian. And most of our believers would agree, it is an evil that shames our cultures. We fight or have fought until we were overruled by courts, but still work to confront our society over this. We tell our daughters to dress more modestly, and encourage (or nag) our children to be chaste.

Second, people bearing the Name of Jesus sometimes sin. For small failures, simple repentance restores our hearts and minds. Usually for the devout found in adultery, the encounter is serious, and sometimes results in divorce and remarriage. They are not playing or trifling. One heart has encountered another, due to weakness in a marriage. I do not condone it, but this would be tolerated in Islam, as an addition of another wife. The first wife would just have to stifle her jealousy. But Christianity does not make so much allowance for lust as does Islam.

Thirdly, and as a private opinion, I believe the issue of the Catholic priests is not merely a matter of people doing without, finally succombing to temptation. I believe it was an invasion of the Church by homosexual opportunists. They found a way to support themselves along with an unending supply of naive victims.

Several decades ago, I met a man who had tried to become a priest. He had been kicked out of a seminary because he would not go along with their agenda. I do not remember his name, or have further contact with him, so I have no proof. (He worked at the University of Houston library in the 70's.)

Many of the mainline denominatins have been taken over by those who do not believe the Bible, the gospel, or have respect for those who do. Their efforts for the last half a century (at least) has been to take control, eliminate the preaching of the truth, and own all property that these denominations have built up over the years. So I do not consider my belief to be far-fetched.

Let me emphasize here, none of us are 100% pure. We live within the parameters of our beliefs, or try to. We all have to repent and pray. Sometimes we have more serious temptations-devastating loneliness, marriages unhappy or old, singleness with unfulfilled physical needs. For some, rape or incest have added problems. Homosexual temptations afflict others. Pornography on the web has added temptation to many men who would never have gone out and purchased it. While I condemn none, and ask for mercy as well, I do not excuse sin or put aside Jesus' holy standard. We can only please God by walking in the Spirit, receiving the forgiveness His blood provides.
I do not mean that we have no blessed marriages. We do.(And some vary in stages, fluctuating.) In fact, the marriage rates for Christians have always been significantly higher than for nonbelievers. In the same way, levels of satisfaction are much increased with the direct variation of those having faith, in contrast to those without. And graduation rates for their children, etc. We would be lying if we said we did not have to face temptations. But the levels at which we are arrested for sin is considerably less. And with less threat, our choice is more truly reflective of how much we feel accountable to God, rather than fear of the society to transgress social mores, and face morals police.

You also have devout men and women. With some hypocrisy in standards. (Something liberals do not seem to understand is that when a hypocrisy exists, it is because the people at least remember the standards and want to appear to obey them.) But keeping women at home, while men are free to carouse in clubs and public places is not the answer. And there is a limit to how much forgiveness should be offered, to extreme levels of hypocrisy.

Oh, and while you deny the deed for sacrifice for sin, I am reminded of another Sura. (I bring this up because while repentance is necessary, meaning not only to be sorry for it, but to turn from it-the issue of God forgiving us is required.) In S.22:34, after discussing the appropriate sacrifices of animals at the "the Ancient House"," it says, "to every people did We appoint rites (of Sacrifice)."

Our sacrifice is of Jesus' blood, offered once and effective infinitely. (The Resurrection of Jesus being proof of the Father's acceptance of payment for our sins. That fact being witnessed by over 500 people who were still alive to be qustioned at the time of the recording of I Corinthians 15:6-7. (See posts about Jesus being the Son of God, for further information.)

Muslim tradition still maintains a holiday at the time of remembrance of Abrahams's son Ishmael. Families sacrifice an animal once a year, for the sake of the sins of the family. This is a pre-Mohammedan custom, though I cannot say pre-Islamic, as the Messenger recorded Abraham, Noah, Jesus and everyone else as saying they were Muslims. (And I read that you also perform this kind of ritual when on the hajj pilgrimage in Mecca.)

I guess in conclusion, I would have to note, though I see certain commitment to standards of godliness amongst present day Muslims, I challenge you to look at your role models. Take a fresher look. See them for the molesters they were-of slaves and children. Not that I would encourage you to pursue immorality. But you deserve a holy example, someone worthy to emulate. Seek Jesus.

What is faith?

After questioning the rationality of those believing in Mohammed and in the Koran, it occurred to me that I should address this issue. Really, I will get back to reading the book and responding to it. I may even share some verses that encourage me (the way they were meant to, and that we can all be in agreement on.)
The Bible says faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things unseen. It points out that one doesn't hope for what he already possesses. So I do grasp that to some degree belief is based on, well, believing in something.
I suppose it is true that "the hour I first believed" it was based on an emotinal response to the message of hope and forgiveness. Hope that I could know God and go to heaven. Forgiveness enabled me to be freed from the burden of guilt and shame. (Though as a sixteen year old I hadn't done a whole lot-my mind was aware of uncleanness, emptiness, and imperfection.)
I have to say, as for as some objectivity, I had had a dream in which God came to me, and told me I was now dead to the world, that He loved me and wanted me to be with Him. Not so much that He wanted me dead, but that His claims on my life left me not free to do whatever I wanted. I had had friends who had told me about Jesus whom I had disregarded.
I only went to the meeting to prove that I was gospel proof, that I was above that sort of thing, to get them off my back. So I was not seeking some emotional release, nor was I trying to lay aside my mind. That night and for the next week, I analyzed what I had done, trying to decide whether I wanted to pursue the commitment made emotionally or whether to disregard it. But the peace of God is hard to disregard, and His love is overwhelming. I could not turn away from that to return to emptiness.

And there is a time when knowing that one knows something is valid. One knows he is in love. Not something easily proven to others, though others can see when a life is transformed. In that manner, I knew that I had encountered God. I wasn't just believing or hoping some Being existed. I had spoken to Him and He had spoken back.

A year or so later, I read discussions about how Chrisitianity is based on historical facts. Neither the Jews nor Romans could find Jesus'body though it was in their interests to do so. The apostles turned from being men of cowardice and expedience to become brave witnesses of something so powerful they could gladly risk their lives, leaving all, to tell the world the gospel. And as repeated before, the 500 witnesses who had seen a resurrected Christ also enlisted in this endeavor, to tell others what they'd seen.
The topping on the cake was the testimony of Paul, that that fact mattered. If the dead were not raised, then, he told us,we are still in our sins-having not been forgiven. And we are of all men most to be pitied.
He does not endorse the modern notion that everybody has to believe in something. (To them it really doesn't matter if it is true, if it makes others feel good and gives them courage to face life.) Several times in his letters Paul discusses all the things he has endured for the ministry. Being beaten and left for dead, whipped, jailed, surviving a shipwreck, and so forth.
He says he has learned "in whatever state I am to be content: I know how to to be abased, and I know how to abound. Everywhere and in all things I have learned both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need. I can do all things in Christ Jesus. Keep in mind this was a member of the elite. Not merely Roman, but Jewish. He was a disciple of Galaliel. Close associate of the high priests-having been given permission to go into other places to pursue Christians, to put them to death. He was born a Roman citizen. He gave up all that prestige, comfort, and security. In exchange for losing intellectual associates, he received for himself being persecuted, poverty, and a virtual nomadic life. Travelling all over the world, he made tents to support himself.
But he would not be stupid enough to submit to this if it were not true.
He had after all, had the opportunity of interviewing some of those 500 witnesses: Peter, and Jesus' brother James, and many of the church in Jerusalem. (This in addition to the personal vision and appearing of Jesus to him.) His choice would be life is too valuable. If it is not true, make yourself comfortable. "Let us eat and drink for tomorrow we die." In another place he states he has the right to have a wife, though he does not. I assume he would not mention this if he did not at times feel the loss of this.
In Philippian chapter 3, he states he has suffered the loss of all things "that I may gain Christ.... That I may know Him and the power of His resurrection, and the fellowship of His sufferings...if by any means I may attain to the resurrection of the dead."
Years later, I endured facing life as well as the costs of believing in Jesus. There were definite times when giving up would have been desirable, certainly less costly in many areas. However, I had to say along with Peter, "Lord to whom can I go? Only You have the words to eternal life." And I still say that, even after reading the Koran and hearing the signs of Mohammed. After all, an apostle who tells his own wife-Khadijah, and his daughter Fatima (according to your hadith) that he cannot guarantee them entrance into heaven, has an empty message. He is powerless to help anyone.
It is air. A faith in which one can only say "I hope that I am" is a waste of effort. It may make for a better psychological experience giving one hope that things will work out all right. But a faith based on air is dangerous.
Air can be magnificient. I can get on an airplane and travel across the world, knowing the physics of air travel is based on fact. Or it can be fatal. I can step off a cliff and it will not hold me. The only times one does not fall from a tall building when separated from a physical support is in the cartoons.
Now I suppose a believer could throw a fit should someone tell him the substance of his faith is air. Yelling and screaming, kicking or stomping, he could defend his belief in his security to step out. But the proof of his faith is not in the depth of his emotion. The proof is whether his faith is stronger than gravity.
If it is not based on fact, no matter how deeply he has devoted himself to it, his faith has failed him. Furthermore, those who taught it to him have failed him too, as well as having deceived their own selves. And someone needs to reach the point where they are willing to shout "stop! Stop this endless procession of well-meaning obeyers from throwing their lives away, submitting to error. Please find something true, and strong enough to hold you."
So I beg you, examine your faith. Not the depth of it, the emotion and devotion to the Prophet. I assume you have the emotional intensity or you would not be reading about this subject. But examine the factual basis. Are you walking on air, waiting for the realization that will start your plunge?
Instead of one who tells his family he cannot help, better to believe in One who promises a total stranger-the thief on the cross who asked for His mercy-"today you SHALL be with me in paradise." Believe in someone with the authority to give salvation.

Is Jesus the Son of God? and other issues

Is Jesus the Son of God? Not according to the Koran. Or should I say definitively not? There is so much repetition of this idea, that I must answer again this issue. Since it is offensive, I will not dignify this with a listing of all the verses. (Hey, it's my blog.) Read some of the books that summarize their beliefs, they will indubitably quote several of these. In short, God has no physical needs, etc. So to Mohammed, it was blasphemous to suggest He would have done some Zeus-like behavior.
Despite the illogic (to quote a friend) of saying God would have to have had sex in order to make a son, the Koran does affirm nothing is too hard for the Almighty. He just has to say something and it is. It explains that is how Jesus was conceived, virgin birth and all. The book also acknowledges that Mary was a good woman. Though it says they both were mere mortals in that they had to eat their daily bread.

Christians are told to "desist" saying trinity, and are told that God can forgive any sin no matter how large, except for this. Those who insist on it are the kafir, who are damned. (Sometimes spelled kafar.) They are charged with being polytheists, for adding partners to God. But just to show that they really do honor Jesus, they admit He was sinless, claim He was the Messiah, and say He was one of the five major prophets.
I don't know how you honor someone when you teach that everything He said or did was a lie. When you say everything He claimed to do, He did not do. When you say everything He claimed He was, He wasn't. And that the authority who declares this is invalid and inaccurate, but in their minds they do.
The Koran even declares that Jesus will return at the last day, and correct all His faithful. He will declare He never claimed to be God, and say He submits Himself to God in Islam (submission). And only those who support the Messenger will be welcomed to the Garden (heaven)as well.

The first time or so you (a Christian) read this garbage, it offends you. Ok, maybe longer. But after awhile, it gets to be kind of a Seinfeld thing,yahdeyadahyadah. (I probably mispelled that, but it means something that just goes on and on that you stop listening to.)
The Koran says He didn't die for our sins, either. God raised Him up, without letting Him die. (The reasoning is that God is faithful to His messengers, so He wouldn't let something like that happen to such a good guy.) Some have conjectured, then who was it on that cross?
Later imams have suggested that perhaps someone was kidnapped and put on the cross, with God changing his face to look like Jesus. Like a holy God wouldn't mind doing that to some innocent person? Because He could play tricks like that and be worthy to be served!
Several problems arise from this besides creating an evil God who abuses people. Jesus told Peter not to fight because He could call down legions of angels to fight if He wanted. He had a purpose in doing it, which could not be accomplished if someone else hung there.
Another theory was that He was on the cross, but God translated Him before He died. I don't know if He just made it appear that He was still there, or put an angel in His place or what. 'Cause for them it's altogether all right for God to trick people. Lying to them is ok too.
A problem with this is it makes Jesus appear like he was their captive. Because if God had no purpose in having Him there, Jesus suffered for no reason? He'd already proven that He could walk through hostile crowds without being captured!

Also I don't know how Jesus managed to speak what is known as the seven last words. Those were the seven things He said before He yielded up His spirit and died. (The last one was "It is finished." He also told his best friend, "Behold your mother," and to His mother Mary, he said "Behold your son." But these aren't mentioned in the Koran. I guess they didn't happen, just as so many things in the Bible are rewritten there. Mohammed doesn't bother to discuss all the witnesses who testified of seeing Him risen, either.
Besides the group of 500 who saw Him rise into the clouds, we have the individual testimony of those to whom Jesus appeared afterwards. Peter, Mary Magdalen, the eleven. Jesus had spoken to two walking down the road to Emmaeus. After He revealed himself to them, they returned late that night, rewalking the entire distance in order to give the others the news. Those others doubted.

Now as they said these things, Jesus Himself stood in the midst of them, and said to them, "Peace to you." But they were terrified and frightened, and supposed they had seen a spirit. And He said to them, "Why are you troubled? And why do doubts arise in your hearts? Behold My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself. Handle Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see I have." When He has said this, He showed them His hands and His feet. Luke 24:36-40.

Then He asked them for food, and ate in front of them, to verify. (He also cooked some fish and ate it with Peter at another time.) Thomas-known as "Doubting Thomas," wasn't there when He appeared. He would have none of it. He knew Jesus had been killed, and even with the body gone, he would only take a rational approach. He said, unless he saw Him himself, and put his fingers into the wounds, he would not believe.
Jesus came and said to him, "Reach your finger here, and look at my hands; and reach your hand here, and put it into My side. Do not be unbelieving, but believing." John 20:27. Verses 28 and 29 record, "and Thomas answered and said to Him, "My Lord and My God!" and Jesus answered him, "Thomas because you have seen Me, you have believed. Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed."

In spite of what the Bible declares about Jesus, Mohammed had his own view. So if you can picture the sinless Jesus, with power over death submitting Himself to "the Messenger," we can continue. Mohammed does say, "If (Allah) Most Gracious had a son, I'd be the first to worship." Sura 43:81.
The Koran also declares that only God can create life. It relates a story of Jesus shaping a bird out of clay, breathing on it, and having it fly away. Apparently this is from a non-Biblical source. But this appears to be creating life to me. It also notes many of the miracles that the Lord did, such as healing the blind, raising the dead, etc. Isn't that giving life too?

I know it is not your fault what the book says. I know you are taught to reverence Jesus, even as He is presented. However, if I write that I honor Mohammed, which I do somewhat, and yet say he was not the Apostle of Allah, or of God anyway, that offends you. Because he claimed to be. If I write that he was not a messenger to warn others, that contradicts what he claimed his accomlishments to be. The same is true if I state that the Koran wasn't given to you from God, but is a man-made tome. Saying this also denigrates the authority you quote.
Yet you expect to say Jesus isn't who He claimed to be, didn't accomplish what He claimed to accomplish, and the authority of the Book that declares this is questioned, and I am supposed to be okay with that?!!! Sorry, since we're all a bit upset here, let's calm down before we continue. Take a few deep breaths. Ok, I'm better. How about you?

Since you (Muslims) are also instructed to ask the People of the Boook if you have any questions, I will again indulge in reporting from the Bible. I will address three levels of testimony. The first is where the Father Himself speaks. The second are Jesus' claims. The third is the testimony of others from the gospels. A fourth, is other parts of our Scriptures, which y'all usually reject, but we do not. I will not include these here, as it is already very long.
I should explain for non-Muslims, that Mohammed taught that all the messengers, including the five prophets got the same message to give to their people. And these are all gotten from the source of the Mother of the Book, which is in heaven. They just believe that all the other messages, like the Jewish law and all Moses' teachings, the "actual" gospel which Jesus taught, and so on, were just kind of lost or corrupted.
I don't know where they get that from, as we have copies of early manuscripts up close to the dates of the early church fathers. (They could have refuted the accuracy, having at the least been taught by those who either knew the Lord or had been taught by someone who had.) That is for the New Testament. For the Old Testament, obviously the scrolls and copies predate that period substantially. And especially many manuscripts exist which were copied earlier than the time of Mohammed. So, if the sources he approved of Muslims referring to were ok then, then you/they are clear. Because the accuracy of our present day Bible is provable to many centuries prior to this. Especially on the basics. This includes the Torah, the Psalms, and the Injil (gospel.)

The account of Jesus' baptism by his cousin John the Baptist (Yahya) describes an example of the first level. God the Father Himself testified of who Jesus is. This occurred early in his ministry.

Now when all the people were baptized, it came to pass that Jesus also was baptized; and while He prayed, the heaven was opened. And the Holy Spirit descended in bodily form like a dove upon Him, and a voice came from heaven which said, "You are My beloved Son; in You I am well pleased. Luke 3:21-22.

The Father Himself testified another time, at what is known as the mount of transfiguration. Jesus, being man who has laid aside the glory of his godhead while on earth, here allows this to be revealed to his three closest followers-Peter, John, and James-John's brother. He radiates glory as He meets with Moses and Elijah who reappear to talk to Him. Moses represents the law, Elijah the prophets, each being a new stage of God's work. The purpose in the Father speaking is to tell Peter not to interrupt.

Now after six days Jesus took Peter, James and John, and led them up on a high mountain apart by themselves, and He was transfigured before them. His clothes became shining, exceedingly white like snow, such as no launderer on earth can whiten them. And Elijah appeared to them with Moses, and they were talking with Jesus. Then Peter answered and said to Jesus, "Rabbi, it is good for us to be here; and let us make here three tabernacles: one for You, one for Moses, and one for Elijah-because he did not know what to say, for they were greatly afraid. And a cloud came and overshadowed them; and a voice came out of the cloud, saying, "This is My beloved Son. Hear Him!" Mark 9:2-7.

Of course, the work of the Spirit verified it too, both in the power of the miracles and the holiness of the life. The second level is that Jesus testified of Himself who He was. I have already written what He said about being the Son of God and how the Jews reacted, understanding His meaning. But another story relates how He believed Himself to be God.

Jesus met a paralytic. He could have just said rise and walk, and everyone would have been impressed. Instead He made it controversial. He said, "Son, be of good cheer; your sins are forgiven." Matthew 9:2b (B. means second part of the verse.)
He asked those who protested, what is easier to say, "rise and walk, or your sins are forgiven?" Now logically, any human with faith might say "rise and walk," and the person might be healed. They would have to have the power of God working, but they would not be saying more about themselves than this.
In pretension, they could have said, "your sins are forgiven," and blasphemed if they did not have authority to do it. (And probably wouldn't be able to heal anyone or have any signs since God wouldn't back up a fraud.) But unless God struck them down, they could get away with the claim. For many have made claims of how to receive forgiveness, and until they die, they could falsely believe. (Either the claimant, or the recipient of the statement.)
But in order to prove that He truly had the authority to forgive sins, which all agree belongs to God alone, He said, "Arise, take up your bed, and go to your house." Mt. 9:6b. When the guy got up, the crowd "marveled and glorified God, who had given such power to men." Matthew 9:8.
Many times the crowds wer not pleased. They were offended that Jesus-this was their conclusion, being man, made Himself equal to God. (See note about C. S. Lewis.)

The third level of witness is the testimony of others. His followers also presented their viewpoints. Jesus asked the Apostle Peter his opinion of who He was at a time when many were leaving Jesus. He declared, "Thou are the Christ, the Son of the Living God." Jesus praised him, saying God had blessed him with this knowledge. Peter also said, when Jesus asked if he too would leave, "Lord to whom else could we go? Only you have the words of eternal life."
If he had been in error, Jesus was more than able to correct him. Just a few lines later, Peter tried to discourage Him from going to Jerusalem. They all knew the danger, and that those there wanted to kill Him. Jesus rebuked him, saying, "Get thee behind me, Satan." This let him know the thoughts were not from God, and that they were from the wrong motivations-of fear and self-protection. Jesus would have rebuked blasphemy.
The gospels were written by or sourced by his disciples. Matthew and John were ones who had been called by Jesus to be of the twelve. Mark, according to church tradition (our hadith) was written down by Mark, but was from the testimony of Peter. As in cultures even today, many have scribes or others better in writing to record someone else's thoughts. Just as Mohammed had men who memorized the Sura's. Then the small parchments, leaves, stones, scrolls, or whatever were later pieced together from when these other men had recorded the words. Whether they remembered correctly, or what was edited by the committee that assembled them, and disposed of those copies they did not approve of, is up to eternity to discern.

As the Apostle Paul noted, Jesus appeared alive to more than 500 after his death, burial and resurrection. And many were still alive at that time, if someone doubted-they could find an actual witness. (Because doubters are almost never questioned or insulted, even if they look for signs. God expects us to use our minds. But that is another issue for another day.)
The gospel of Luke was written by a doctor who attempted to investigate the other witnesses, and interview many to try to provide "an orderly account... that you might know the certainty of those things in which you were instructed." He also claims to have "had perfect understanding of all things from the very first." This includes things only Mary could have told Him.

So what did these witnesses record?

John the Baptist (Yahya) said.... "Behold the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world." Besides instructing the crowds with this, John taught his own disciples more.
A man can receive nothing unless it is given to him from heaven. You yourselves bear me witness that I said I am not the Christ but I have been sent before Him. He who has the bride is the bridegroom; but the friend of the bridegroom, who stands and hears him, rejoices greatly because of the bridegroom's voice. Therefore this joy of mine is fulfilled. He must increase, but I must decrease. He who comes from above is above all; he who is of the earth is earthly and speaks of the earth. He who comes from heaven is above all... For He whom God has sent speaks the words of God, for God does not give the Spirit by measure. The Father loves the Son and has given all things into His hand. He who believes in the Son has everlasting life; and he who does not believe the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him.

Paul had a vision of Jesus, which was good, as he was actively persecuting the church at the time. Being responsible for the martyrdom of many, his transformation was powerful. He went into Arabia to escape persecution himself, and perhaps because the Lord sent him there. Somehow he was taught the gospel, which he later checked with those who had known Jesus to verify its accuracy. They gave their stamp of approval. Neither Peter, nor Jesus' brother James (who were the leaders of the Church in Jerusalem) would have given it if it differed substantially from what they had heard for the three years of Jesus' ministry.


And oddly, there was the testimony of demons. They did not want to be bothered by Him before the last day. So they asked if they could go somewhere else. This is about what they said:
Jesus, thou Son of David, what have we to do with thee? Are you going to punish us before our time?"
They knew who He was, His authority, but that what was to happen was for a later time. So they asked if He would send them into a group of pigs, if He was going to cast them out of the demoniac. He did, and they stampeded that herd over a cliff. Not sure why that solved their problem, as they were almost immediately having to deal with the same problem of needing a new body to inhabit. But the guy whose life had been destroyed, mutilating his body and living within a cemetery, was delivered and healed-free from being possessed by legions of demons.

In one of Jesus last sermons to his disciples before He left them to go into heaven, He said to them, "These are the words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things must be fulfilled which were written in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms concerning Me." And He opened their understanding, that they might comprehend the Scriptures. Then He said to them, "Thus it is written, and thus it was necessary for the Christ to suffer and to rise from the dead the third day, and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in His name to all nations, beginning at Jerusalem...." Luke 24:44-47.

And John records that "truly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name."
In fact most of the writings of John are on this subject. So I refer you to the entire gospel of John and his epistles for further study. And I conclude with a quote from I John 5:5,10-13.

Who is he who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God? ...He who believes in the Son of God has the witness in himself; he who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed the testimony that God has given of His Son. And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

Blog 11-The opposite of Psalm 1

Sura 14:26 is another opposite. This time the reverse of Psalm 1.
"The parable of an evil Word is that of an evil tree: it is torn up by the root from the surface of the earth: it has not stability."
The Koran continues. Verse 24 shows the good ones. The word is about who believe and stand strong. Of course, v. 28 explains the reason someone has been witnessing again, apparently successfully this time.
"Hast thou not turned the vision to those who have changed the favor of Allah into blasphemy and caused their people to descend to the House of Perdition." (Remember equating Jesus with God is unforgivable.) For those unfamiliar- a brief review of Psalm 1. I provide this to show the depth in the Bible, compared to the Koran. Note the progression of verbs, as well as that of the nouns.)

"Blessed (happy, fortunate) is the man who
Walks not ---in the counsel of the ungodly
Nor stands------ in the path of sinners
Nor sits ------in the seat of the scornful

But his delight is in the law of the Lord (mediatating on it day and night)
He will be like a tree planted by rivers of water
That brings forth its fruit in its season
Whose leaf also shall not wither,
And whatever he does shall prosper."

Everybody who spends much time in a church where the Bible is taught learns these verses. I had forgotten the rest, but there is another parallel to the three parts from above.

"The ungodly are not so. But are like the chaff which the wind drives away. Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment
Nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.
For the Lord knows the way of the righteous but the way of the ungodly shall perish."

He doesn't walk--is blown away
He doesn't stand-in the judgment
Nor sit in the congregation of the righteous
In fact, the way (path) of the ungodly shall perish.

Blog 10-Our Intercessors

Reading of the Koran can be so nebulous that those unfamiliar with the Bible can easily believe much of the complaints are against pagans. Since the names "Jesus," "Christian," or even "People of the Book" is used much less than the generic "Unbeliever," it is easy to ignore what is obvious to those who do know it. While the term "partners" could be passed off as referring to true polytheists, the term"intercessor" cannot be. For this reason, I have chosen to address the teaching about the role of an intercessor in the Bible.

Sometimes it is used in both Old and New Testaments to instruct us to pray for others, interceding at times they may not have the strength or right relationship to do so for themselvs. That is a worthy study in and of itself, but that is not what the Koran is speaking of, nor is it the most important use in the Bible.

The Koran is refuting claims of those who say they will not be condemened to Hell, because they have an intercessor in Heaven who will draw the mercy of the Almighty over them. They will be covered from His wrath, and from the just punishiment of their sins.
Our brothers would have pulled out their Bibles, or scrolls, or repeated from memory the Scripture verses to back them up. The book of Hebrews goes into much detail, chapter after chapter explaining why "He ever liveth to make intercession for us." See Hebrews excerpts about Jesus' role as our High Priest/Intercessor.

After He offered Himself (the offering of His Blood in the true Holy of Holies), the sin offering being accepted once for all, not needing to continue offering a sacrifice for our sins before the Father, since His work was done, He sat down at the right hand of the Father. This is where Jesus is today, where He was 1400 years ago-at the Father's side interceding for us. As a go-between before the Holy God who must punish sin and injustice, and frail humanity much in need of mercy, He defends us. He says to the Father, "yes that is sin, you are right. It is evil. It deserves the completeness of Your justice." He doesn't just wink at it, and say, "Well, men will be men, give them a break." He says, "They have called on My Name, that My Death would substitute for their spiritual death. Having asked for Mercy, I sprinkle my blood over their sins." (In actuality, He died for all mankind, but it only avails if they ask for it. He doesn't force Himself on others.)

Here is what happens. The smell of my sin evaporates. The sin itself is forgiven and forgotten. The Father sees the purity of the Son when He looks at me. That allows for my heavenly salvation. But there is more.
The Father already knows the weakness of men. How could He not? He's observed them since Adam's fall.The Old Testament says He remembers we are but dust. And it was the Father's good pleasure to send Jesus, His own plan-not something Jesus talked Him into.)

But Jesus, having been man, has been tempted as we are. He knows the shininess of things. He knows the betrayal of friends. He knows the harshness of the accusations and plots of enemies. He knows the desire to get even, or to want to defend yourself. He has been tempted-yet He did not fail, did not acquiesce to weakness, to bitterness, to hatred. He was tempted, but lived without ever sinning. Who better could speak to the "Immortal, Invisible, only wise God" to explain our needs? To tell Him what we need in order to overcome, to plead for mercy, for patience?

When He forgives me, a new thing happens. As far as the east is from the west (infinite), so far does the Father remove our sins from us. He sees me clean and spotless, the person He created. And a new life begins in me, to make a new creation of me. Let us not look at me, but at His work as it continues.

He sends the Holy Spirit to live in me. He is to teach me of Jesus' ways, direct me into truth, and equip me-giving me power to obey what is asked. He also prays for me-even in my groanings because the Father knows the mind of the Holy Spirit. When I do not know what to say-for lack of wisdom about what to pray for, or no matter what my need, He will speak to the Father for me.
What Jesus does in the Heavenlies, the Holy Spirit does from inside me, on earth. That is, they intercede for us. This is why we are told not to quench the Holy Spirit. And to keep our bodies holy-knowing they are the temples of the Holy Spirit.(This is very encouraging, as we have a three-fold chain of prayers about our needs-our own, Jesus', and that of the Holy Spirit. Throw that in with the love of the Father who already wants to provide for us, and possibly the prayers of other believers, and we should be afraid of nothing.)

This secondary intercessor is only available as I have already received the work of the first-Jesus. The Holy Spirit is also called the earnest (down payment) of our inheritance-the communication God gives that we may know what we have believed is true. (We don't have to wait until we're dead, and cry "oops," if we're wrong.) Our Scripture says He (Holy Spirit) seals us, closes us up, to protect us. And as in Roman rings with seals of wax, it stamps His Authority and proof of ownership upon us. Just as the Resurrection is God's proof of the efficacy (effectiveness) of Jesus' death for all mankind, receiving the Holy Spirit is our individual proof that God has accepted it for me.

Hopefully, this explains why the Koran says "and no one can take the punishment of another," in addition to denouncing intercessors not approved of by Islam. It is responding to the claims of Christians. The myriad number of times the verses denounce those who claim to have intercessors, is because Mohammed is addressing Christians. They are sure of their salvation and will not be moved. So every time you see arguements against intercessors or partners who intercede, please remember whose theology that reflects.

Post 12-Forgeries: duplications and imitations

I mentioned copying the Bible. This is not merely something I noticed. He was called a forger, and teller of tales of the ancients, multiple times throughout the Koran. In addition, instead of coming up with new analogies to illustrate his point, Mo borrows many Biblical terms, although some he uses differently. This is a thorough study in and of itself. But just for a beginning, he mentions the straight way or straight path dozens of times (3:101, 4:68, 5:18, 6:153, 6:160, 5:80, 10:25, 2:142, 6:39, 6:87... I stopped writing them all down.)
Here are some other comparisons borrowed, but not a comprehensive list of each time used.

Acquainted with all things, grief 6:103
Ask for forgiveness 70 times-9:80 (if you do, Allah won't give it)
Baptism 2:138
Braiding of strands 16:92
Brotherhood 49:10 (without a Father?)
Come to thy Lord 89:28
Cupful 78:34
Dead raised up (pre-Mohammed) 6:36
Deafness of hearts, veiled so can't see 6:25, 17:45-46
Dry bones 36:78
East and west 43:38
Eye of the Needle 7:40
The even way (strayed from...) 5:80
First death 37:59
Good news 22:34, 37 and 39:14
God has purchased the Believers 9:111 (with what?)
Godhead 43:15. 42:21
Great News 78:2
Great Salvation 85:11
Guiding the Blind 10:43, 13:16, 19
Haman and Pharaoh 28:6,8 and 28:38, 29:39, 40:24,36
Hearts understand not, eyes...,ears... 7:179
Heaven, well done, enter here 39:73
Holy Spirit 2:87, 5:113, 16:102, other places
If could return from the dead 6:27-28, 23:99
Justification 77:6
Keys 6:59, 42:12
Lay foundation on sand (cliff) 9:109
Light 24:35-37,40
Man having two masters 39:29
Mohammed releases from heavy burdens 7:157, also follow the light in that verse
Moses serving for wife yr. 28:27
New Heavens and a new earth 14:48
New life 16:92
No burden except what it can bear 7:42
Oaths 2:225, making/breaking 2:224-225 (it's ok)
One day is as a 1000 years 22:47
Opposite of Psalm 1 is 14:26, and surrounding verses
Pharaoh worries about them changing their religion 40:26
Pharaoh's wife takes baby Moses 28:9
Problems of nursing mothrs 22:2
Render back trust to whom it is due 4:58
Seal our hearts 2:7 (to not believ in Islam), 4:155
Spiritual life as running a race 2:148, 79:4
The straight way, path, etc. 4:68, 6:39, 6:87, 7:16, 37:118, 36:61, 5:18, 6:153, 6:160, 22:54, 42:52, way that is straight 3:101, 10:25, 2:142
Trumpet 36:51
Truth 10:35
Twinkling of an eye 26:40
Verily, verily 78:5
Virgins with lights 57:13
When you are wronged fight 42:39, approximate eye for eye 42:40, but forgiving ok too 40:43
Whoso will 73:19, 76:29, 78:39, 80:12, approximate 81:28
Witnesses to the nations 2:143
Works are as ashes 14:18
Yokes on unbelievers 34:33, yokes 36:8, 40:71

Hardly comprehensive, but it's a start. For those who don't have much familiarity with a Bible, a concordance at the back will help you locate the parallel verses. At this point, I haven't looked up all the Bible verses. Those familiar with it will recognize most of these. However that doesn't help those who are not. Later, I will return with the Bible verses so you will know which ideas were plagiarized from the Bible.
I will grant that some ideas, such as justification could easily be in both without any fraud. But the plethora of it, no it is not possible. The probabilities of this many copies being accidental are too remote. This is only about the terms. This is not to mention the percentage of the book spent referring back to Biblical stories, or guys in the stories, with new accounts not in the Bible, whether opposite or not.

Mohammed vigorously denied it, saying repeatedly who would sin against god more than one who claimed he had spoken when he had not. However, he also includes one allogation that I found interesting. Especially when combined with others, and other information he'd already provided.

Forging and telling tales of the ancients is listed many times.
Another merely mentions he has help from others. (Which of course is contrary to the teaching that the revelations are given directly to him.)
On another subject, he severely instructs others not to enter his private roooms late at night, early in the morning, and at noontime without knocking. He also tells them not to enter his house without permission. Presumably this is to protect modesty and ensure children and servants do not see any activity between himself and his wives, or see him or the others in a state of undress. But consider if it is true, that he had help-from those who knew the Bible better than he. They would not want to be caught. Of course, someone with the retinue of Mohammed could presumably keep out any he wanted any time of the day. And he did still retire to the cave occasionally. But still.

Post Seven

The punishment of those who do not believe is taught in both books. Some is standard-burning in hell. Some in the Koran are new and unusual to the western world. There are eternal consequences, as well as finite ones in this world. For a hell description" Sura 10:4 (last part of the verse. The "Him" is Allah, although in actuality, it is Mohammed. Some suras discuss that if you reject some of the messengers but still believe in the almighty it isn't enough.)
"Those who reject Him will have draughts of boiling fluids, and a Penalty grievous, because they did reject Him." Coffee anyone? Hot tea or cocoa?

A few days and Suras later, I found more. The following was my response to this.
Oh, the thoughtfulness of the Father! For those whose lips have not named Mohammed as God's Messenger, the Koran declares (10:4), He will provide draughts of boiling fluids. Verses 16 and 17 of Sura 14 explain more. Though the water was fetid, it was boiling, (thus purging the impurities from it and making it safe for us to drink.) And I was worried that I'd have nothing to quench my thirst from the fire! We'll sip it in gulps. Since we'll never be near swallowing it down, it must replenish, to have an endless supply. Just consider the varieties: chicken broth, hot chocolate, hot tea-wonder if it will be Moroccan?

Hot coffee, anyone? I don't really do all those different types of coffee, so I'll leave it for you. Put in your order early if you want whipped cream, or milk, or any of those more expensive drinks. I'll stick around for various soups, and the assortment of teas. Gosh, that makes me thirsty, think I'll go make myself some hot tea and practice sipping in gulps.

Hey, good news. After all the verses that mentioned boiling water and liquids, I thought I might get tired and want something cold. Sura 78:25 came to the rescue. A fluid, dark, murky and intensely cold will be provided for us.
Is there anywhere CocaCola can't get into? Or maybe it's Pepsi. Wonder if they'll have a MacDonald's?


About that time in hell, remember what we call things is the reverse of what they do. Christians are unbelievers while they are believers. Kind of an opposite day. So I guess for them a place where Jesus is honored as the Son of God, the Intercessor for our sins, and the Lamb of God who takes away the Sin of the World, a place full of people who reject Mohammed's message, that would be considered hell. Not me. A place full of my brothers and sisters who cry "Holy, holy, holy is the Lamb of God," and who serve hot tea. That's great. It always makes me relax, so I can fall into a self-indulgant sleep. Nothing wrong with a little nap, especially when we have all eternity.

Another thought. Later on I came across a few verses that discuss our skin burning. I am a bit sensitive, having had one more sunburn than I cared to many years ago. (My skin is frequently very white, due to avoidance of sun.) The Lord brought to my remembrance the story of Daniel's friends back in the Bablyonian captivity. There they were, the three thrown into the middle of a hot furnace. Not only did their skins not get burned, but observers saw four people in there. One was like the appearance of the Son of Man. (See the book of Daniel.) So, wherever I am in eternity with my Savior, I'll be just fine. But what are you going to do if your less than sinless intercessor doesn't qualify?


Originally I left it here, but I worry for two reasons. A Christian reading this, might misconstrue my humor and think I should not accept that I would go to hell. My response is of course. I assume those reading it should know I am saying this tongue in cheek. Let me reassure all I do not believe that I would be under judgment, or end up in hell. I firmly believe the Lord Jesus has rescued me from that fate and assured me of my salvation. I have already stated an important difference to me between believing in Jesus and being Muslim is assurance of salvation. That implies deliverance from hell!
My concern for the Muslim is that he think I jest and do not take seriously enough the threat of hell. On the contrary, this is the very reason I write at all. Not that I am concerned for my fate, but for that of others. The reason to jest at all on this subject was that I did not want to end up in a children's sqabble-I'm right, no you're not, yes I am, .... And I did find interesting the subject of eating and drinking. I hope you did too. draft

Ideas we can agree on

Many of the verses are fine, with which we can have consensus. I list ideas rather than just verses, as most are repeated frequently. Some are ones where we can sympathize, though not commiserate.
Why won't they believe? We tell them and tell them of the greatness of God, of His power and mighty works, but no one will listen.
The problem is he lists reasons to know there is a god, and says therefore, serve Allah and His Messenger. It's a necessary but not sufficient point. We may believe in God, but how do we know it's Allah? (And if the Messenger isn't included, it doesn't count.)

Other prophets too have been rejected. We've already discussed this, but you really get the feeling of self justification and near martyrdom-not necessarily in a self-righteous tone, but heartfelt. Then he discusses his followers. Those who suffer for the sake of the kingdom of God (Christian term, but equivalent-for the cause) are not equal to those who come in without paying a price for commitment.
Though he speaks of those who have killed Christians, still I understand. Losing houses, going into banishment, or moving to avoid persecution purges one. It requires the examination of the depth and cost of commitment. Thus to continue following means fully embracing the value of the issue.
Similarities in theology exist. The afterlife awaits us, whether heaven or hell. We will have to answer for our choices, behavior, and beliefs. God is merciful. Only God can forgive sins or create life.(There are many differences, as well.)
God is worthy of being served. Nothing else is as important. Those are fools who pursue this world's approval or its riches, other than what is necessary to provide for themselves and their families. The faithfulness of God to His people is one of the subjects mentioned in the Psalms that we are to recount to our children, to others, and to sing about. So we have no objection to Suras that remind us of these.
Except of course the small problem of claiming all the work God has done with the Jews or Christians as work for Islam. I think the rest of the world understands these folks as Jews or Christians, or both. Taking these parts of other's history and claiming it as God's faithfulness to Islam is truly distressing, revolting, humorous, and bewildering.
If you want to prove God's faithfulness to you, have evidence of His work with you. Thus, the complaint of the Unbelievers- Where are the signs? Our own holy men, prophets or not, had miracles done for them, if not by them.

Were these verses we agree with not strewn with insults to Christians (or those who add partners to Allah, or claim intercessors for them) and dire threats for insulting God by claiming He had a Son, we would find it easier reading. Also they claim that holy people should pray, fast, do good to the poor. We agree with this, except that the Koran says that those who do all this without accepting "the Messenger" are wasting their time. To those who think they can earn their salvation, we say "likewise."

One other question I had, was that sometimes to avoid a problem, Mohammed would say no one could be an intercessor for someone else without God's permission. Now, if the Koran admits Jesus was sinless, and was one of the five prophets sent by God, why would God turn him down? Especially if God was tolerant enough to accept someone who was not sinless- like Mohammed.

The Son of God

Christians believe Jesus was the Son of God who came to die on the cross to take away the sins of the world. The above sentence holds multiple layers of blasphemy according to the Koran. We also believe He sits at the right hand of the Father to make intercession for us. Those recalcitrants who would not convert frequently mentioned this in their reasonings. They had to-or Mohammed would not list this as one of his main complaints.

"They will not listen..., such are some of them...," so he cries repeatedly. Of course, to the Messenger this cannot be because they know that they know the Lord. Nor can they be assured of their salvation, instead of merely hoping for it. Allah has sealed them, has hardened their hearts, so that they will not believe. And someone has taught him predestination.

He strives to show that no one can know God. He is too exalted for this. Sorry, but every Christian who calls Him Father is going to explain that we can, and do. And as Jesus said, if we said we didn't know Him we would be liars.

Another factor is this incredible show of humility and subjection. But it is false humility, what the Bible calls a show in will worship. (Galatians I think, I cannot find it it, but Colossians discusses false humility. Must have been in a different translation.) Islam claims to emphasize God's mercy and forgiveness. But the Koran states Allah does not love sinners. He only loves those who are faithful. So the point becomes how much self-control do you have to have to earn Allah's love? And if you live a righteous life, seeking Allah for decades, at the last second you can fail and go to hell.

The Resurrection is our proof of God's acceptance of Jesus' sacrifice for us. Jesus could have told us He would die for us, and having died,we'd have no proof that the Everlasting God accepted that death as a payment. Coming back proved He did. Paul stated that without it, we should not continue. (I Corinthians 15:5-7, 12-19, 32.)

...He was seen by Cephas, then by the twelve. After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have fallen asleep. After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles.(5-7)
Now if Christ is preached that He has been raised from the dead, how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ is not risen. And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is vain and your faith is also vain. Yes, and we are found false witnesses of God, because we have testified of God that He raised up Christ, whom He did not raise up-if in fact the dead do not rise. For if the dead do not rise, then Christ is not risen. And if Christ is not risen, your faith is futile; you are still in your sins! (12-19)
If, in the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantage is it to me? If the dead do not rise. "Let us eat and drink, for tomorrow we die." (v.32)

Wasting our lives on a false hope is not something Christians are willing to do. Why Muslims are is beyond me. Certainly, many live righteous lives as it is humanly possible. Prayer and fasting, separating themselves from drinking, adultery, open lust, or materialism, reveal a dedication to seeking to please God.

Unfortunately, you will never be good enough. (None of us are.) The Bible says all our good deeds are as menstrous rags, which is quite a stench. (Living in a day and age of disposable supplies, that is still powerful. I cannot even imagine what that would be like in older days, or third world countries without them.) In addition, it says there are none who seek God, no not one. Jesus clarified it that none could come to God unless the Father drew him. As for our faith, John 3:16 says "For God so loved the world that He gave His only Begotten Son that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life." (If you have the desire, come and get it, God offers it.)

Romans ch. 5 emphasizes that if God loved us while we were His enemies, how much more He would love us now. (Rom.5:6-11, and 8:32.)
For when we were still without strength, in due time Christ died for the ungodly. For scarcely for a righteous man will one die; yet perhaps for a good man someone would even dare to die. But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation.
Romans 8:32 adds, He who did not spare His own Son but delivered Him up for us all, how shall He not with Him also freely give us all things?
Jesus taught of the Father's love- Luke11:9-13.
And I say to you, ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find, knock, and it will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened. If a son asks for bread from any father among you, will he give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will he give him a serpent instead of a fish? Or if he asks for an egg, will he offer him a scorpion? If you then, being evil know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him! (And the other gospels leave it open that we can ask for other things too.)

So we have no doubt of His love. And as for our security, Jesus said that those who were His could never be lost, or taken from His hands. He would protect them. (This comforts me that the Lord will restore those who walk in error.) John 10:14-15,28-30, 31-38.


Besides the audacity of claiming to know God-or perhaps because of it, Mohammed expressed another complaint against Christians: bragging and supreme confidence in their Lord. He termed it the strutting about of the Unbelievers. I love this. Because when I have to explain the superiority of knowing that I am forgiven versus hoping to be, I will exult in it. Earlier I mentioned how much Mohammed complains. Although I can't vouch that it is in every Sura, this awareness is rampant.

People claiming intercessors-Mo promises that these helpers won't be able to convince Allah. People depending on partners associated with God, such as Jesus or the Holy Spirit. He rarely makes any kind of point without referring back to this. (He actually interrupts himself so often it becomes distracting.)
To me, this makes the claim that he was delivering the society from paganism so spurious. The amount of arguments against idol worship and the foolishness of serving something man-made would be much increased if he were genuinely concerned about them, or if Allah was. As it is, the frequency seems about 50 to 1, or more in comparison to arguments against Christians. And maybe 20 to 1 against Jews, who also are monotheistic. (The Lord our God is One, etc. Though the Holy Spirit is acknowledge in the Old Testament, as it is in the Koran.)

At one point, I guess when I first read the description of strutting, I was very defensive. Many of the Christians I know are fine persons, humble no matter what their level of society. So if someone was inflated with themselves, that would indeed be wrong. But if the boasting is of Jesus- of knowing that we know that we have indeed received our forgiveness, that is allowable. We do know the living God, and call Him Father-having freedom to enter His presence lovingly, worshipfully, and dare I say it, boldly. That indeed is shocking to those who believe the Almighty too exalted for mere men. Those ask only to be His servants.

I do not mock them, for in truth He is beyond what we deserve to know! We are unworthy, though He deserves to be worshipped. Wise is the man who abases himself and offers himself humbly before the Lord. Until he comprehends the magnificence of what He has done-the depth of His love for us, and the efficacy of His sacrifice.
Then he is foolish if he can believe his own heart will ever be pure enough to please Him, or his deeds excellent enough to impress Him. And fool he is if he refuses God's free gift. Arrogance leads him to feign submission as a servant when God desires him as a son. Dare we refuse adoption? And He gives us His Name, as part of the deal. Compare this to what Mohammed says about adoption, see post 10.

So knowing what and who we are, we would logically jest at one's suggestion we deny our Sovereign Holy Lord. We would not turn to one who makes us servants and who leaves us with an unsure hope. Some of our brothers told Mohammed this.

The Bible has many words on boasting too. I will share a few. Paul said in Galatians, "God forbid that I should boast, save in the cross of Christ our Lord, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world." Gal.6:14
So if we boast for Him, then let us glory and strut when confronted with those who disbelieve the promises. But first let us humbly relate the good news. (Gospel.) For by grace are you saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God, not of works, that any man may boast. Ephesians 2:8-9.
Then let us walk, boasting: "I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that He is able to keep what I have committed unto Him against that day." 2 Timothy 1:12.

And about that strutting. I do so want to get it right! Do we walk straight ahead with our arms swinging, or do we put a little jaunt into it swinging side to side, a little like John Wayne? Perhaps we hold our heads up, with backs straight and our noses in the air. Sura 3:196 just notes it. Sura 14:43 has more details. This may not be strutting, but it seems so. "They running forward with necks outstretched, their head uplifted, their gaze returning not towards them, and their hearts a gaping void." (No, I didn't mess up the grammar. My experts who wrote the books say it's like that even in Arabic. The Koran has to add words in parenthesis regularly to make sentences make sense.)

In context, the Sura 14 verse is a picture of Unbelievers running on the Day of Judgment. During some of the raids he had seen this. It was a vivid picture in his mind of people trying to escape. Those who did this were described as doing wrong. They said with confidence when threatened with death they'd suffer no loss. Who has such assurance as Christians?